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Here is an interesting answer, posted on Quora, by Josh Siegle. His answer paraphrases some of what I tried to highlight in my post “Substrate Neutrality: Representation vs. Reproduction“.

Here are some quotes, starting with a comment by Josh Siegle from an ensuing discussion:

I’m saying that meat has properties and causal powers that algorithms do not. If the properties we’re talking about are mass, acidity, or opacity, this statement would be trivially true. A simulation of an apple will not weigh 0.1 kg, taste delicious, and appear red, although all those properties could be represented. Claiming that awareness is somehow different—that it would be present in the simulation—suggests that it is not part of the physical world. This leads very quickly down the path to a dualistic separation between the mental and the physical, which I imagine is exactly what you’re trying to avoid.

Quotes from the original answer:

First of all, imagine that the book in the room is a Chinese–English dictionary. When the Chinese characters come in, the man translates them into English, thinks of a reply, and translates that into to Chinese. BOOM! The room now acts as though it understands Chinese, but does it actually? I don’t think we gain anything by saying that it does. It should be obvious that the true understanding lies in the person that wrote the dictionary, and the man in the room is just piggy-backing on this knowledge. If not, then I could claim that I understand every major language because I know how to use Google Translate.


If instead of a string of Chinese characters, the man received a string of ones and zeros encoding a visual scene, would the room be having its own, separate visual experience while the man moves some paper around and reads the ink that adorns it? People make it sound like Searle was bonkers for claiming that such subjective experience wouldn’t arise. But what makes you so certain that it would?

What Josh Siegle appears to be saying is that consciousness is, in some respect, similar to properties such as mass or wetness. In the same sense that you cannot extinguish a physical fire with simulated water, a digital computer will not possess the same sort of conscious understanding that humans do.

In his original answer, Josh Siegle wrote that it is a given that the Chinese room passes the Turing test. That is not being disputed. The claim is rather that human understanding is more delicate (qualitatively different) than e.g. the ability of a system made up of a human and Google Translate to understand various languages.

I consider this a relatively weak claim, but nonetheless something that should not be dismissed. Namely that one of the most important, and morally relevant, features of human understanding could be related to the hard problem of consciousness, and that consciousness is a property that is in some relevant respect similar to physical properties such as mass or wetness.

Consider the following. Knowing every physical fact about gold does not make us own any gold. A representation of the chemical properties of gold on a computer cannot be traded on the gold market, established as a gold reserve, or used to create jewelry. It takes a particle accelerator or nuclear reactor to create gold. No Turing machine can do the job.

There is nothing spooky about this. The point is that a representation is distinct from a reproduction. Only if you reproduce all relevant physical properties of e.g. water can it be considered water in the context of the physical world.

The evidence in support of consciousness requiring a similarly detailed reproduction is our inability to explain how we intuitively disagree that a person with a Chinese–English dictionary does possess the same understanding of Chinese as a person who actually “understands” Chinese.


A Turing machine (Rules table not represented).

Can you program a Turing machine in such a way that it would end up in a state mimicking all relevant physical properties of water, in order to drink it? It seems rather weird to claim that a device that manipulates symbols on a strip of tape could configure itself in such a way as to mimic water. In the same sense it would be really weird to look at a configuration of logic gates and proclaim, “This configuration of logic gates experiences pain!”.


A Turing machine can exhibit a certain number of states. None of those states can possibly correspond to a number of physical properties such as acidity or wetness. The Chinese room thought experiment highlights how none of the states of a Turing machine could intuitively mimic conscious understanding of Chinese.

Or to quote Magnus Vinding, “just like a computer will not have Wi-Fi if it does not have the hardware that supports it – regardless of what software we implement in it – a computer will not be conscious if it does not have the right hardware.”

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